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« Brief Commentary on Today's Nokia Bad News Day (updated 3x) | Main | News Update Only, Blogs Coming Soon »

June 15, 2012

Comments

elm70

@cn

Childish is who still believes in Santa Claus
And who believes that eFlop works for the good of Nokia and all the Nokia shareholders

Nokias is dead, is not me saying it, it is the market
Stock market value Nokia less the if liquidated tomorro
Bonds market want over 10% return for a 2 years bond, almost like Greece bonds that are totally outside control

Last two quarters Nokia bleeds billions in cash flow, at this rate the survive time is limited

Current production of Nokia is hopeless, maybe only future Nokia with WP8, maybe can find a market, but if they miss xmass sales, or initial reception will be cold, both very possible cases, Nokia by beginning of 2013 will be out of cash.

Tchuss

E_lm_70

CN

@elm

What is this now? You've been posting these "Nokia RIP" for ages and now you start to come out with "maybe with WP8, maybe whatever" and "if they can make it by Christmas". I'm lost with you, I simply don't know what you are trying to say. Now you suddenly have all these options on table that would take Nokia forward.

Earendil Star

@ CN

please, stay on topic and focus on what counts, not on the least important things, as usual.

In any case, actually what I reported is not "my" BS, it's MS' BS. As for yours...

It's MS that Osborned WP7 and felt compelled to switch to WP8, explicitly confirming that WP7 is an obsolete POS: it lasted approximately two years on the market in total (fact). Gaining low single digits market share (fact). While being supported by an unprecedented marketing effort worldwide + the Nokia brand (fact). Condemning first generation WPs including Lumias to a sudden death (fact). Congrats, MS & THT Elop. What an epic failure!

So, if you don't like it, please direct your complaints to MS.

Incidentally, I noticed you chose not to counter any of my arguments. Not a single one. Tough, isn't it?

Rather, sadly, you were just able to come out with a baseless personal attack:
"you are also known to publish questionable / false claims here"
Also?? Do you mean as yourself?? And what's your definition of false claim?? Anything that is critical of the current MS and Nokia course of action in mobile?? And who says so?? You?? What a laugh!!!

Which confirms my claims. And, no, rest assured: I was not expecting you to heed my plead :)

elm70

@cn

Nobody can say if tomorrow is raining or not

But in a scientific way, it can be stated 70% chances of rain

Same apply to Nokia death

What I'm saying is that by 90% Nokia is dead by 1h 2013

Math is simple

Survive = wp8 in time multiply by warm reception of wp8

So 50% x 20% = 10% hope to survive :-)

If Microsoft borrow money to nokia for keep it alive, nokia become a total slave of Microsoft, so nokia maybe not in bankrupt, but it is dead as an independent company

Tchuss

E_lm_70

Evicator

Carriers buy phones in huge numbers and then sell them to the customers. They order the branded phones from Nokia at discounted price.

There is a huge storage with Nokia Lumias in carrier's back room.

CN

@Earendil Star

You have this long emails repeating the same things over and over again. My only argument is that have you ever thought about how many people out there know what is WP7.5? Or WP7.8? Or WP8? Or WP? iOS? Android? And do they care?

Check this one out. One of the leading OS's installed base. See how most of the users simply don't bother about issues we talk about here.

http://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/index.html

And another one:

http://theunderstatement.com/post/11982112928/android-orphans-visualizing-a-sad-history-of-support

If continous support of OS is so bloody important as you try to make it look like, shouldn't we see it with Android too?

Yes, also you giving false statements. The other one is naturally Tomi. When I ask Tomi to fix simple mistakes that he is publishing, he deletes the comments. Then, worldwide press is quoting Tomi, with the false information. Sad.

In this forum, definition of false claim is that you give wrong information that makes something look far worse/better than what it is. And this happens a lot in here, that you can't deny.

BeastOfBataan

This Microsoft partnership is stupidest I have ever seen! What kind of partnership is that where the other partner gives some loose change and the other party any valuable thing he has. In top of that crawls on the floor!

Son, I'll tell you what, have some self confidence..Lady Gaga and Nicki Minaj have the same smells there..no need to be so f---n sub-ordinant to any foreign clown!

elm70

@CN

Tomi giving wrong statement and not correcting them ?
I have seen him updating his blog multiple times .. and these big mistakes as you mention ... maybe are just different point of view.
Not always fact are black or white.

Anyhow, about customers ... all I know is this:
- Once customers did enter in a shop and asked for a Nokia phone.
- Now, customers enter in a shop, and ask for an Android :-o

I'm sure of Nokia would have jump on Android like Samsung did, they will be still the #1

But, as "Earendil Star" is saying multiple time ... then Elop the THT did enter in Nokia.
I think what is writing "Earendil Star", should be written endless everywhere, until a criminal investigation is open over Elop.

This is what I would expect from Finland.
No, I never asked, not I want Finland to buy Nokia shares for take over the control. A country should not do this.
But, yes, the smell of a crime is all over Nokia and Elop. Why an investigation is not already open ? Why documents are not acquired, why Elop phone is not controlled ? ... this is something absolutely normal in many other nations.

Tchuss

e_lm_70

ps: Italy did protect Fiat, Germany Opel, US GM, etc etc, sorry if I mention the car bizness. Belgium did protect Fortis, etc etc ... Finland did NOTHING for protect Nokia from predators, criminal predators.

Earendil Star

@ CN

Again, what are you talking about?

First, we are discussing about Nokia here, and why it crashed from being n.1 to practical irrelevance & serfdom.

This happened during THT Elop's tenure. Would you deny this?

This happened after partnering with MS. Would you deny this?

This is what counts and should be said and repeated, because most of the press is silent on these topics.

Android? Who cares about Android! Android has nothing to do with this post by Tomi.

Besides, the real comparison should be made to the iPhone (that WP is trying to copy), not Android.
Would you say Apple is NOT updating its phones for its own customers?
What MS did is like if Apple had released the Apple 4s, and a couple months later said they were coming out with iOS 6wp that would not run on the iPhone 4s, while all new apps would not be working on the old platform. Yeah, we know very well Apple would never do that. They don't need to. Their OS is fine. Their apps numerous and gorgeous. As for WP7... it sucks. This is why MS itself is replacing it.

By the way, since you raised the issue, no Android flagship user got screwed the way Lumia 900 users have been. Why? Because most Android apps will also work on previous versions of Android, irrespective of the version they are running.
The SW technology is mostly the same. Improving, getting better, as smooth as butter. But it is still basically the same.
Not so with WP. This is the huge difference. And this is why everybody (except MS fanbois) is saying that WP7 users got screwed.

In any case, your off topic quote on Android is raising more alarm bells: who are you posting for? Lol.

*****

Having said this, let's talk about something serious now.

It appears that the joint Apple + MS & Nokia effort to wage a legal battle against Android is mounting. The attack is decidely going on on more fronts.
On the one hand, Apple managed to have the Galaxy Nexus banned in the US. On the other front, MS, ehm, Nokia, is now alleging that the Nexus 7 is infringing its patents.
The move by Google to acquire Motorola Mobility is now becoming more and more justified.

Competition is no longer on the market. The struggle for market share is now being waged in Courts.

We'll see how Google comes out. Everyone is trying to bash them. A few examples.
1) Oracle: the first round with Oracle was a win for Google. But the appeal?
2) Apple: Galaxy Nexus banned in the US, but in the UK, a Judge has thrown out Apple's allegation that HTC Android phones were infringing on its patents. In Australia, the Galaxy Tab was initially banned, then admitted. In Germany the Galaxy Tab had to be slightly changed to be sold.
3) MS: already leeching many Android OEMs, à la mafioso (Barnes & Nobles anyone?), now exploiting its Nokia longa manus to hit its most formidable rival: Google.

Thermonuclear. That's the word the late Steve Jobs used when talking about going after Android. Tim Cook is following his former boss path.
Oblivious of the Xerox Park origins of the Mac. And oblivious of how MS built its fortune by copying Apple and the Mac.
But most likely Apple is going for Android because that's where the real threat is. Not from WP and MS in their eyes.

In any case, very interesting times ahead. We'll see how things unravel! Very exciting!

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Tomasz R.

The Nokias problem with patents is that a company that cuts R&D and layofs engeneers won't get many patents granted. So now they have a portfolio they can use, but in the future they could easily be sued by others, that do R&D now. Sued by Google which invests in software, Samsung that invests in hardware or by chipset makers they don't buy from (Intel, TI, Broadcom, Nvidia etc.). So in the near future they are going to be just another phone maker that faces product bans in patent-crazy countries, while those who invest now (like Samsung) are going to be powerhouses imprevious to that.

Adrian

I seriously think Elop is a MOLE, sent by Microsoft to kill Nokia. He is a puppet at the hands of Ballmer, why else would one kill the hand that feeds you. Let alone a WP8, I even hate a Win7 PC to work on, it crashes a million times a day. I am sure Ballmer has other plans like buying over Nokia at dirt cheap price & all its invaluable patents.
What Nokia should do is - split the company into 3, (1) exclusively for the WP (2) tieup with Google & launch 7 to 8 Android phones to combat Samsung & the likes (3) develop the new & existing opportunities like TABLETS & develop Symbian and MeeGo OS. Well then in a years time look at which company has given the maximum profits, close down/re-develop the loss making unit.
At the end I only hope Nokia to survive else we will loose a great mobile player with awesome hardware capability.

manalisa

Nokia employee admire Microsoft, because of their bad culture or gene. They are simply killing Nokia by injecting Elop (a MSFT employee) into our Nokia.

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