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« What Happens Now to Nokia Lumia and Windows Phone, After Microsoft Throws Nokia Under the Bus? (Updated) | Main | Congratulations Mike Short for CBE Honours at Queens Birthday in UK - here his Foreword to my 3rd book »

June 27, 2012

Comments

oncemaemodeveloper

@tomi You are right about Samsung being dissatisfied with bada. I talked with Samsung's head of R&D in April and he was quite frank in that "bada is not very good". While it still outsells WP, Tizen is where most of their money seems to be in. Although they never make the mistake of putting all the eggs in the same basket. Oriental mindset I guess.

Another thing I want to set straight. N950 is basically the same HW as N9, only a bit better, with a proper keyboard and a slightly better chipset. Outdated by now for sure but would have been very competitive when it was new two years ago. N950 (codename dali) was the main development platform for Harmattan for a long time. It was obsoleted only when the developers were told to disable the landscape mode in their applications, which pretty much crippled the user experience for such a phone. It was a shame because it would have been cool.

When people talk about the late delivery and outdated HW they should know that Harmattan was destined to launch late 2010. It just happened that about that time there were major changes in the design (like dropping the landscape mode) which delayed it some eight months more. Many thought it only got worse since then.

I know these things for fact because I was there, doing the development in Ruoholahti. Which is also why I have to hide behind a pseudonym here. Sorry for that, and sorry I cannot back up what I say with my true name. I guess you all know why that is.

Roy

I bet Stepehen Elop will no longer be Nokia's CEO by February 11th 2013.
(The problem is maybe Nokia will be bankrupt by then...)

On a side comment, could some please help me verify this:

It appears that Nokia Conversations has not only begun begun censoring comments that don't support the Windows Phone agenda, but as of today June 27th they are tampering with the voting system in their own site, to try to control all the negative comments when you click like", it appears that comments from posters which are negative to Windows Phone are flagged by their moderating team and if you press "like" on that message instead of increasing the "like" count it actually decreases, I just realized this, and I'm baffled they are actually trying to steer opinions in this way, And guess what? if you press like on a positive comment to windows phone the "like" count does increase.

Could somebody else please confirm if this is really happening at Nokia Conversations?

This is the thread: (Comments 21 to 30) Nokia at Windows Phone 8 unveiling.
http://conversations.nokia.com/2012/06/20/nokia-at-the-windows-phone-8-unveiling/#disqus_thread

Check these not so good posts about WP8 form the posters below, if you click on "like" it will actually decrease the (it just did it as of 20:30 GMT -6)

John Kowalski
Spyinthesky
TechInsane

Can anyone confirm please?

nnine

@KPOM @foo @Aikon

Pr 1.1 and Pr 1.2 brought some nice features and improvements, but I was happy with my N9 even before that. It was also released before the Lumia phones, which also had more problems at launch time. So I do not believe that "Meego was not ready".

Another argument was that Meego could not made to run on enough devices fast enough. This has been debunked by one of Nokia's own engineers:

http://felipec.wordpress.com/2011/06/21/my-disagreement-with-elop-on-meego/

Hoista

Most likely explanation for the board of directors behaviour is Groupthink.

examples -
Bay of Pigs invasion
Challenger Space Shuttle Disaster
Invasion of Iraq

The desire of a collective agreement to go windows phone has led them to reject all other alternatives. Look at some of the close-mindedness that is happening. Very rarely is there any talk about other platforms, Elop even refuses to mention Meego in any of his talks anymore. They are rationalizing their strategy, windows phone will work because the 'next version', the 'next phone' will be better / backed with a big corporation in Microsoft. To me, there is clear selection bias in the decision making and projection of fault. It's not my fault the phone isn't selling, it's the carriers fault. etc.

GoneIn60Seconds

@Hoista,

Great that you mentioned the term. I agree with your analysis.

It is terrible really what happens when any group starts to rationalize own behaviour and starts to aim at consensus, instead of thinking about the situation like they would if they would be making the decision on their own!

aikoN

@Roy,
Nokia Conversations is pretty boring now. It's just an advertizing channel roe Lumia/WP.
There was much more comments from people who really care about Nokia before real Nokia stuff was cleaned away and replaced by WP.
Sometimes it looks like the only people responsible for "Conversations" comment each others "news" in a overexcited, overoptimistic manner.
Really sad place now.

aikoN

Skype was mentioned many times as a reason for operators to hate Nokia.
My personal experience is that Skype works best on both iPhone and Android handsets. When we come to Nokia, at least with Symbian, Skype performs not so good, it's a kind of unstable (imho) and lacks video calling. I don't have any experience with Skype on WinPhone. Nokia N9 lacks video calling too. What I'm trying to say is that Nokia is the last one I will come to when I need good Skype experience.
I just can't understand.
Can someone explain me that?

Strtxi

@Hoista, GoneIN60seconds - thank you:

"It is terrible really what happens when any group starts to rationalize own behaviour and starts to aim at consensus, instead of thinking about the situation like they would if they would be making the decision on their own!"

Instead of seething with fury over past mistakes, which ( quite understandably) seems to be the groupthinking prevalent here - what would be the correct ( realistic ) course of action for Nokia Board now?

imho: Elop is executing a drastic change strategy accepted by the Board. All his major actions are actually slowed down by the same Board. Someone already said Nokia has probably tens of thousands too many people. And, most of them have a quickly waning or even obsolete set of skills which could NOT produce a Symbian / Meego / whatever based product to make any significant entry into the U.S. market. And claiming that U.S. market does not matter is burying your head in sand - Apple has recently reported HUGE sales increases in China ( despite not really having a proper presence there and there product being tens of times more pricey in relative terms for any regular consumer, even for the upper middle class earners ), with product and service mainly created for the individualistic american and "western style" consumers.

GoneIn60Seconds

Yeah, thats really a conversation killer when everything must be really excited and optimistic. Well, it aint that way in the real world. The apps in the Nokia Conversation look like a pile of shit.

GoneIn60Seconds

@Strtxi, groupthink does not mean any common opinion. It means striving for a consensus at a price of suppressing individual opinions and thoughts. It is a survival instinct for humans.

Nokia phones division has about 40 000 workers and it is true that 99 % of them have now obsolete skills or are just administration doing nothing every day.

jcamdr

@Asko: Thanks for the information about how the vote of the board was done. I can't remove from my head the idea that the "large American institutional shareholders" was coordinated from Microsoft. Probably impossible to investigate.

At least this show how can shareholders destruct a company.

PlatformWarrior

Doesn't look very good what BOD is doing. See the latest (Google translated) comment from the Chairman: http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=fi&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hs.fi%2Ftalous%2FSiilasmaa%2BElopilla%2Bon%2BNokian%2Bhallituksen%2Bt%25C3%25A4ysi%2Bluottamus%2Fa1305578379595&act=url

Jethro

Hi, Mr Ahonen, I admired your blogs a lot and would like to thank you for using so much time to make all these satistics. I was wondering if you would give me your opinion if Elop step down or change his plan, will Nokia bounce back? Although it is impossible for it to reclaim its past market share, but will it survive till it could restore its former glory?
i think if a petition is made for elop to step down would be great, provided the board listens, but seriously, what have gone into their head?

Lasko

Risto Siilasmaa, allow me to introduce, reality. Where midterm and longterm financial result mean illiquidity and insolvency, profitability and competitivness is at an all-time low, where critical feedback remains unheared and the products which won numerous competitions are not the ones you primarily sell.

If anyone is still in doubt that Elop does not act on the Boards will read the article linked by PlatformWarrior.

AtTheBottomOfTheHilton

@Lasko

If the BOD don't have the confidence for Stephen Elop, he would be sacked right away. The question is more what is going on in heads of the BOD including Stephen Elop. Nokia has plummeted and its stocks are no more worth than break crumbs. Something is wrong with the current strategy of Nokia. Either they are in some kind of denial after a rigorous Microsoft brainwash and/or some BOD member are too scared to speak up. I can only speculate but something is not right.

mikkisofter

Elop admits again that Burning platform memo hurt Nokia a lot.
http://mynokiablog.com/2012/06/28/elop-interviewed-at-aamulehti-more-pureview-more-location-more-differentiation/

vladkr

@mikki:
Thanks for the article; Elop is even more a jerk than I used to think

MikaA

Local newspaper wrote something of Elop's visit to here. He is reported to having said that he is sorry, but the rate of change in the mobile business was unforeseen and that is the reason for the lay-offs. He mentioned that Oulu and Salo will remain valid locations to Nokia, though it didn't take long from that interview until I started to see pictures connecting Elop and the information minister of Iraq, he was actually captured by a photographer in the almost same position! Personally, I just don't believe this one bit, and apparently neither do the Nokians.

None of the above is that surprising given the track record, but the interview of Siilasmaa is just bizarre. He is saying something like: "I have always counted the number of shares I own, and if I get the same number as before, I haven't lost anything. Of course losing value in the short time is painful, but this is a question of what you believe in the long time intervals."

Basically he also repeats that Nokia is fully confident that WP8 will gain market share and that the operating system is usable in all devices from mobile phones to computers. I'm sure Tomi can refer his interview a lot better than I do. The main thing is that I just can't help but think that Nokia already had that kind of operating system coming up!

Cana Da

I guess after RIM released its devastating quarterly numbers today, the question is who ceases to exist earlier, Nokia or RIM.

Somehow it is funny, RIM, the Canadian company, goes out of business, and Nokia, led by a Canadian, is also going out of business. I never had anything against Canadians so far, but now I need to reevaluate.

Leal

What is Nokia still waiting to give Elop a one way ticket to the moon? Enough is not enough??

The comments to this entry are closed.

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