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« Wisdom of the Tweets - another Twittercontest, now guess Lumia Q2 sales | Main | Digging Deeper into Nokia Q2 Results - and exactly how many 'awesome' sales was AT&T and China... (Updated) »

July 19, 2012

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Comments

vladkr

Tomi:

You forgot that Canada is part of North America :

- Rogers sells Lumia 710 and 900 (+ few symbian phones)

- Telus sells the Lumia 800,

- add few smaller carriers (Videotron for instance) which sell Symbian smartphones (501, C5, C7, E73...)

- and oh... just found out Videotron sells Lumia 710 as well (they collaborate with Rogers actually).

So, the 600K smartphones sold in North America are for AT&T, T-Mobile, Rogers, Telus, Videotron, and few others I forgot)


It's still interesting that NSN, which Elop wanted to get rid of, saves the situation a little.

Irek

Nokia shares are up 15% in pre-market!!! WTF!?

Stoli89

Your last revised 2Q2012 forecast for Nokia smart device sales (8.4 Mio) undershot the real mark (10.2 Mio) by 21%.

Are you proud of this estimate?

Matti

Tomi yuo seem that have missed the crashing ASP on Lumia devices.

"The ASP of our Lumia devices in the second quarter 2012 was EUR 186,
compared to EUR 220 in the first quarter 2012."

They got that 4 million with aggressive price cuts and incredibly wastefull marketing.
http://www.tietoviikko.fi/kaikki_uutiset/nokian+lumia+900n+markkinointi+tuli+kalliiksi++370+euroa+puhelinta+kohden/a822858

Hpeters

Nokia is fucked

Kenny

Units shipped and sales are not the same. Units shipped include all returned units which in the case of the Lumia is very high and for Lumia 900 is super-high. From what I gather in blogs and Nokia support forum, many U.S. buyers had to change their set 2-3 times before they can get a decent working model or accept some defects.

Of the 600,000 units shipped to N. America and after deducting dumbphones, Symbian phones and Canada sales how many Lumias are actually shipped to U.S.? I think 300,000 is a pretty generous figure. If we deduct returned units the figure may well be halved - a miserable 150,000 Lumia actually sold in U.S.

zlutor

@Tomi: actually the '4million' is sold, not shipped only - according to http://mynokiablog.com/2012/07/19/nokia-conference-call-details/comment-page-1/#comment-618940

Kenny

No, zlutor, from the actual source here: http://www.results.nokia.com/results/Nokia_results2012Q2e.pdf

On the first page,
Commenting on the Q2 results, Stephen Elop, Nokia CEO, said:

"We shipped four million Lumia Smartphones in Q2,and ..."

Kenny

Oh yes, units shipped also include unsold units.

Ovidio Morales

@Vladkr: Actually, Mexico also forms part of North America... :) So those 4 million are spread even thinner.

zlutor

@Irek: believe or not it happens in recent announcement days of quarterly results. Usually it lifts 15-17% up in one single day (announcement is done) and fall back in the coming day(s)...

Reason? Stock market sharks... ;-)

zlutor

@Kenny: yes, I've read the result. But I attached a link to MyNokiaBlog where they refer to the conference call made after the announcement...

vladkr

@Ovidio:
You're right, I'm sorry I didn't count Mexico as I don't know if it's included in Nokia's North American or the Latin American figures.

By the way, you point out an interesting question:
are the Caribbean islands (Bahamas, Trinidad&Tobaggo, Dominica Republic, etc.) included in North America?

I know it usually doesn't change much, but when figures are as low as 600K units, the question deserves to be asked.

Ok, I stop trolling, the situation is critical enough :)

zlutor

@Irek: BTW it clearly shows how pessimistic investors are towards Nokia. Even less - but still huge - quarterly loss could boost the share price.

OK, it is just a one-day-miracle but still...

Irek

@zlutor: yep, the market expectations were a lot more pessimistic and priced in accordingly, hence the jump. The thing to consider now: is nokia underpriced? Could this be the right moment to buy Nokia shares again. I don't think that Nokia will seize to exist any time soon, so there's got to be a bottom. Is it now? Food for thought.

J.O. Aho

With this bad sales for Nokia and it's Lumia line, I think Jolla Mobile will have the good chance to overtake Nokia in some markets maybe as Finland and even in China, when it comes to smart phones.

At least I will consider a Jolla device as my next one, if not that then it's a Tizen.

khim

Guys, can you please, stop this silly nonsense about "sales" vs "shipments"? This is just a marketingspeak.

From Apple's 10-Q SEC form: "Net sales consist primarily of revenue from the sale of hardware, software, digital content and applications, peripherals, and service and support contracts. ... For most of the Company’s product sales, these criteria are met at the time the product is shipped."
http://investor.apple.com/secfiling.cfm?filingID=1193125-12-182321&CIK=320193

Nokia does things similarly. The fact is: ALL companies report shipments as sales. No exceptions. This means that you should take the numbers with a grain of salt (Apple tries to keep inventory as small as possible while some other companies sometimes "stuff the channel") but these are the only numbers you can actually get. Everything else are guestimates.

HHEriksen

Regarding the shipped/sold details in the Nokia Q2 report, the Elop quote says 4M units SHIPPED, but a later explanatory paragraph states 4 million units SOLD.

note

http://seekingalpha.com/article/732691-nokia-management-discusses-q2-2012-results-earnings-call-transcript?part=single

Steve

http://yfrog.com/mnm06lp

CN

@note

Thanks for the link. Now, I hope all will read it through carefully since already now there are news talking how Nokia shipped 330,000 Lumias to US, as stated by Timo Ihamuotila, the CFO. That's nonsense, he never said anything like that, but TechCrunch, PhoneArena, SeekingAlpha, WMPoweruser etc are efficiently spreading this one.

I guess, Matt Burns (TechCrunch) gets the credit this time - I feel he tried to tell the truth, but has been misunderstood.

Roman

@Baron95 Will you also congrat another 10k nokians who will be fired soon?

zlutor

@Baron95: are you just kidding, aren't you?

Since Symbian is a burning, dead platform, designed and implemented by stupid, lazy non-california based idiots, so it should not ship at all.

So, maybe the rest of the 10 million was all N9s... :-))))

Jesus Christ... :-(

Vinicius

Actually, N9 sales being 100k is very impressive.

It is no longer sold in 50%+ of the few countries it was launched at.

And I don't think it did too badly overall. I don't have any data to prove this (nor anyone else outside Nokia), but I think N9 may have outsold the entire Lumia series until now. I don't think it is currently being produced anymore.

Sam

@Baron95 The sales lf N9 are truly amazing compared to the fact that Elop (worst ceo ever) has made all thing imagined to kill the whole product... And basically no marketing for N9 as well.

The sales just clearly show how great N9 is. Go Jolla with Meego! Definately my next smartphone!

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