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« How Microsoft Lost the Future (Updated with Ballmer Quote from Seoul) | Main | Paging Truth Police: No! Windows Phone and Nokia Lumia are NOT outselling iPhone in China. Utter BS story spread by Microsoft propaganda machine »

May 21, 2012

Comments

jcamdr

For information:

100 Most Valuable Brands: Apple Tops Again; Nokia Disappears

http://allthingsd.com/20120522/100-most-valuable-brands-apple-tops-again-nokia-disappears/?reflink=ATD_yahoo_ticker

"""
Nokia, which ranked 81st in brand value in Millward Brown’s 2011 study after a 28 percent year-over-year decline in value, fell even further in 2012. So far, in fact, that it seems to have fallen right off the chart. Not a surprise, really, given the company’s current situation. But worth noting just the same; as recently as 2008, Nokia was the world’s ninth most valuable brand.
"""

Regards, JC

Eurofan

Eduardo: I agree but think too that the reason for the campaign is also to prolong Elop's tenure at Nokia. All the lies will come out every quarter when numbers are published and annually at stockholders' meeting so there is really no point other than to pretend longer that Elop's plans for Nokia make sense until he can do maximum damage to Meego/Linux open OS in the handheld space. I now think the whole point was to crush Meego/non-Google Linux as a viable OS to make room for WP -- and of course to use Nokia marketing muscle to help promote WP. I think MS will settle for killing Meego and this is what Elop is obviously bent on doing, the dork. Otherwise, what is the point of lying about things which will become clear in a few months, quarter after quarter, other than to prolong the agony for old Nokia? I too feel sorry for Nokia employees. Nobody deserves such a fickle employer as would turn over the reigns to Boston Chicken's ex CIO. He helped them go public and then go bankrupt. Nothing changes.

Eurofan

http://www.businessweek.com/1996/43/b3498139.htm

http://www.delibusiness.com/Attachments/bostonmarket9-98.pdf

two good articles, one two years before Bankruptcy, one directly after, both from trade objective trade magazines. Elop was CIO from going public to months before bankruptcy.

harry113

@Tomifan

Why doesn't Mr. Pope just simple prove whats wrong with Tomi Ahonen's statements? Tomi makes at least 100 statements in every blogentry - I mean they impossible all can't be true?! All Mr. Pope must say is, Look here are the salesdata here and there is this video from there - this is therefore not true, etc. From reading this blog Tomi Ahonen sure has a strong opinion about this industry, but he shows numbers, research which cleary indicates he is telling the truth - while Mr. Pope just make bla bla bla. Which *is* quite sad.

@all

And it really doesn't matter if there is an Skype boycott or WP boycott or not - the numbers speaks for themselves. Nokia (as is) is a dead man walking! Nobody in theire right mind would now pay for a non upgradeable WPhone, when at fall the new WP8 will be released. Talk about a second Elop-effect!

togga

@PeterElgin @QtFan
If you look at the bottom right, it's actually nr2 on the "sales chart" (google translated).

http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=cn&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fchinatelecom.hicdma.com%2F

It must be the Nokia Army recruiting and stockpiling... "Latest Lively" doesn't show any Lumia.

Prakriti

@BjarneH: well said about enterprise market and best products-- and this not being viable when selling to consumers.

and about N9 being a timeless solution.

lets see though which way the wind blows... today I read Nokia World will be much smaller this year... and held in Finland and separate sessions instead of one big event.

What shocks and disgusts me the most is the passiveness and incompetence of the board of directors... they are just playing along like lambs to the slaughter.

maybe Jorma is deluded-- but are all the others drunk or do they have their heads buried in sand ???

Prakriti

what you need is a Finnish Muntadhar al-Zaidi... to raise the temperature and create talk and discussion.

remember the Iraqi journalist who-- first shouted at George Bush for waging a war on false pretexts that killed innocents, created widows and orphans--- then threw his shoes at George Bush???

His career was ruined... and he spent 2 years in jail and suffered and got his teeth broken-- but he had more guts than any of the Nokia VPs and anyone in the Nokia Board of Directors... because he called the Emperor Naked.

Being from a different culture; I cant understand thousands of laid-off employees are just silent... not giving a damn about their company's future...

BigJohn

Mr. Pope needs to soon worry more about finding a new company and a new job than about claims about his former boss.

DITTO!

postcards

Hi there,

Therefore allows begin with the actual cal . king from the slope. Special introduced the Universe S3 also it usually experienced quite strong earlier wedding reception. Right now all of us noticed a week ago, which Special has used nine mil pre-orders.


thanks
mariya

Peter

TomiFan,

Have you looked at Q&A for Nokia Q12012 conference call ?

Analysts have asked a couple of critical questions which Elop either answered with off-topic stuffs or answered with "I am still learning and adjust based on changes".

Does nokia need to hire a still learning CEO after 16 months in charge ?

Re-read those transcripts before to take any excuse for your criminal boss Steven Elop.

Tomifan

@Peter
not my criminal boss, but thnx anyway.

Earendil Star

Dear Tomifan,

THT Elop was very ambiguous in his statements, as always, so telling who is wrong is quite difficult.
Yet, the points you raise are rather trivial, and you are missing (or voluntarily overlooking) what really counts.

Just think... if there is no reseller boycott, and still WP does not sell, it means...

WP IS A TERRIBLE OS NOBODY LIKES NOR BUYS.

Not my opinion. It's the market, baby.
Which proves once again what I always said:

WP IS THE BURNING PLATFORM

which THT Elop is desperately trying to salvage, depleting Nokia by using it as a fire extinguisher.

No conspiracy theories here. Just observing facts and applying common sense.
As for you, in your futile attempts to always prove Tomi wrong, you are unwittingly proving that WP is bad.
For which, I thank you. Cheers mate!

Tomifan

@EarendilStar
I'm not saying WP is "best OS ever". I'm trying to point out that Tomi's "global operator/resales boycott" is a conspiracy theory and does not turn into reality by repeating it and cherry-picking words from someone's speech.
So yes, unless a new explanation (or better sales figures) can be obtained, we should assume people just don't want to buy Windows Phones. (Which does not stamp actually stamp OS bad, people do buy phones based on many other things than just OS being good/bad).

hpp

What about these?
http://gs.statcounter.com/?PHPSESSID=1rqa5t3g6namtin80j49shh4j2#mobile_vendor-ww-monthly-201201-201205
China looks interesting
http://gs.statcounter.com/?PHPSESSID=1rqa5t3g6namtin80j49shh4j2#mobile_vendor-CN-monthly-201201-201205
Asia, Europe and North America are pretty much like expected
http://gs.statcounter.com/?PHPSESSID=1rqa5t3g6namtin80j49shh4j2#mobile_vendor-as-monthly-201201-201205
http://gs.statcounter.com/?PHPSESSID=1rqa5t3g6namtin80j49shh4j2#mobile_vendor-eu-monthly-201201-201205
http://gs.statcounter.com/?PHPSESSID=1rqa5t3g6namtin80j49shh4j2#mobile_vendor-na-monthly-201201-201205

Tomifan

@hpp
There is rather interesting "Unknown" that steals market share mostly from Apple. I have to assume their metrics are f*cked up because some models do not get counted towards the brand they represent.

@tomi
Aren't timezones terrific? West coast USA has been awake just for few hours and when you'll wake up, they have had full day to surf the web and read blogs (and their comments)!

jack1059

Its been said before, and I've possibly missed the answer. But what's going on with the nokia board? Why just sit there and accept the massive destruction of the company? The stock devaluation? Loss of reputation? Do you have any insights Tomi?

Tomifan

@Jack
it has been asked and no answer given. Tomi has hard time explainig it, because either Nokia board consists completely of imbessils or he is wrong and Nokia strategy actually makes sense.
Which is more likely?

Mush

@Jack & @Tomifan

It seems Nokia's board is confident that the new strategy will eventually pay off. The new chairman Mr. Siilasmaa told before the AGM that "I'm certain we have the right team, the right strategy and increasingly the right products to emerge as a successful company" (http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20120503-705879.html)

And here is another interesting quote from http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/flow/item/14751_Snippets_from_the_Nokia_AGM.php:

"Jorma Ollila reiterated on exceptionally strong words that the change in strategy was mutual, decisions and reasons for it agreed and approved by the board and that Stephen Elop had his and their full trust."

Hooray.

Earendil Star

Tomi, just to let you know: something is moving...

Google filed a complaint with US and European authorities over the MS & Nokia joint Mosaid trolling venture.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/google-alleges-microsoft-nokia-are-abusing-mobile-patents-in-complaint-filed-in-europe/2012/05/31/gJQAHW8S5U_story.html

Many of us had highlighed the absurdity of Nokia abandoning its grip on its core patents, and sharing it with MS through the Mosaid deal.
Just to explain: Nokia, while receiving no clear benefit in return, gifted some 2000 core patents to a Canadian (like THT Elop) company, Mosaid, and... voila... suddenly also MS was benefitting from these patents alongside Nokia. A move that absurdly devalues Nokia's IP treasure chest.

Totally unexplainable, unless you remember that THT Elop is just pursuing the MS agenda, and that Nokia is just being scavenged to rescue the burning WP platform.

Well, it appears now that Google, after knocking out the clumsy Oracle attack on Dalvik and completing its Motorola Mobility acquisition, is now starting to strike back on MS and its practice of blackjacking OEMs à la mafioso, forcing them to pay fees on Android installations. Very interesting.

By the way, also amusing is that the Washington Post is saying: "2000 Nokia AND MS" patents. Yet this is blatantly false. Even Mosaid itself says all patents were Nokia's:
http://www.mosaid.com/corporate/news-events/releases-2011/110901.php
And this is very well explained in this ZDNet article by long time softie supporter MJF:
https://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/microsoft-weighs-in-on-mosaid-nokia-patent-deal/10523

As somebody already pointed out, this is more and more a battle of mis-information, not ecosystems.
The ecosystem battle is already over, and the winner is not WP.

QtFan

@Earendil Star
Came here to post the same thing.

Not only Nokia is using its patents to attack every target MS points at, but they are also going to share pillage with MS.
Nokia is truly MS's lapdog. Nokia is being stripped of all assets it has left.

At least, "Google vs Oracle" was some very good news both for android, every tech company and society.

Tomifan

@Tomi
I should probably ask:
You have made it clear that the path for Nokia is to take now a very humble "yes, we will do anything you say"-attitude towards operators. When you replied to my comment (not this thread) you said it's not for long term and Nokia can break out of that bond when it's stronger.
How?
How could Nokia ever break out of that? You have pointed it out multiple times that operators have single-handedly killed Nokia sales so badly that the heaviest marketing campaign in Nokia's history is having no effect at all. And all done so that looking from Nokia perspective, operator is willing to support the sales with all they can. (But actually they are just taking all the money and selling other phones. Yes, it's the MS/Skype boycott I'm talking about.)
If they could do that now, why couldn't they do it again if Nokia starts to look so strong that it could break out of the operator bond? Having such a powerful tool, why would they ever let a good captive go?

Pripyat Bhakti (india)

How You feel now Nokia engineers, buyers, officers, as your workplace is soon beginning to crumble..?

Perttu, Joni, Timo from Oulu... what are your feelings now as your large mortgages are defaulting..??

Tomifan

@PripyatBhakti
You don't honestly think that any of the Nokia employees possibly commenting to here would answer to such a question? Employees of any of the companies I've worked for are not supposed to speculate with company future or financial status, I'd be surprised if Nokia would be different. And your question is as loaded as "have you already stopped beating your wife?"

elm70

TomiFan

The point made by eFlop about the Microsoft ability to control Skype is a perfect absurd statement

How can you state that Google and Apple can't control Skype, while Microsoft can?
What is the point?

Yes Skype works better on Android then on WP, simply because, Microsoft has a joke OS.
But funny enough, Skype apps for iPhone and Android are done by Skype, so by Microsoft

Yes, Google and Apple have nothing to do with Skype, and clearly if Skype is ruining you business, you don't bring your money to Skype, so not to Microsoft that own Skype now

I think Tomi is 100% right, after Skype acquisition, WP that was a looser OS, now is a dead OS

Tchuss

E_lm_70

Tomifan

@elm70
Nice to hear from you again. :-)
Using "who did the app" as an argument is like saying that wind is generated by trees waving back and forth.
Those app versions (Android and iOS) were written by Skype way before MSFT acquired Skype. But Mr. Elop did not say MS did all those apps. He said that "By actually controlling the Skype asset, we can begin a conversation about how we can have a better Skype-based relationship, which was impossible for operators to do before."
So my point still remains:
Google can't force modifications to the Skype app for Android.
Apple can't force modifications to the Skype app for iOS.
MS can force modifications to both (And to WP version, of course).
And that has nothing to do with the "which app version is best to use". If they would be really evil, they'd make all other OS versions operator-chargeable EXCEPT for WP. But that is not a good idea for WP point-of-view as Tomi has pointed out in the past.

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