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May 10, 2012

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Zenman

If you repeat the lie 1000 times it becomes a truth. Not true.

Fan(atic)

Only 2010 words, are you losing your touch?

Let us summarize it all in two paragraphs:

Tomi Ahonen, a 90's tech guy trying to make living in selling calendars and books, by keeping an awful noise about his former employer. He call people names and goes personal, even without being confronted or questioned. After 1.5 year of personal slander against anybody he knows by name at Nokia, someone finally asks him to stop or at least to stop picking words and facts out of context.
Now Mr Tomi Ahonen goes ballistic, how can anyone question his authority and right to go slander people 24/7 on the web? Now Tomi Ahonen is engaging in a one-sided and asymmetrical warfare (if I read him right) - anything goes, blow up children if it makes some noise. I'm sorry Tomi, you might be a terrorist, but very few notice you, and even fewer care. You are literally Mr Nobody!

JJ

That dog yelps, which the stick hits.

JD!

If things are not correctly said, why Nokia is taking this seriously?
They can avoid.. But not... As they know they are going down.
"All things go in one way... When the end is near"

JD!

Forgot this...
What is it that Nokia has done right since management change???

Ken

Hey, Tomi, something very interesting here:

101 REASONS NOT TO BUY A WINDOWS PHONE 7.5
http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=44034

Amazing! Mind Boggling! If this gets out Lumia is doomed!

anti

Tomi is a guy who wants to be someone huh?

vladkr

Congratulation Tomi, you're replacing Eldar Murtazin as Nokia's enemy #1!

Yes, the Skype affair is widespread all over the world now, although Nokia didn't need any more damage to its reputation.

Other news that aren't good for Nokia:
DEALTALK-Nokia's woes might call for Microsoft aid
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/06/nokia-microsoft-idUSL5E8G4AR220120506

http://www.intomobile.com/2012/05/08/nokia-close-their-ruoholahti-office-helsinki-finland/

sepi

http://www.intomobile.com/2012/05/08/nokia-close-their-ruoholahti-office-helsinki-finland/

This article doesn't mention that Nokia is only relocating its research centre closer to Aalto university and EIT. Intomobile is only trying exaggarate things.

Tomi T Ahonen

Hi Zenman, Fan, JJ, JD, Ken, anti and vladkr

Zenman - and the truth, said 1000 times still remains the truth. I asked John Pope to show me one quotation of Elop that is fabricated. He ran away and said he doesn't need to prove what he said.

Fan - haha, yeah, totally losing it. Don't worry longer blogs are coming again. Now, I like the picture you drew of my terrorist alter-ego, a nice little Bond villain there. The facts don't sit with that view. I have not had a 1.5 year attack against Nokia here. I was initially TOTALLY supportive of Elop. Even after severe shock of Feb 11, 2011 (1 year, 3 months ago) I wrote clearly on this blog, while I think it is highly risky and my personal view is it will fail, the Microsoft strategy might work for Nokia and we must give it time to see if it does. I said the time frame to know if it is succeeding is about 2 years so end of 2012. That all changed when Microsoft bought Skype, and when I could clearly see in June 2011, that Nokia's Microsoft mission is a suicide mission, I started to call for its end, and for alternate plans. But also, if you read this blog, I have not been only critical, even of Elop. I have recognized him when he has (rarely) done something right, like reversing his originally stupid numbering/naming plan, and when he finally in later Lumia models reversed some of the anti-consumer design issues (removable battery etc). And finally Fan, as long as you are here, it really doesn't matter if nobody else cares about me, I am still a somebody. I felt so diminished by your posting, obviously.. Cheers!

JJ - Se koira alahtaa johon..

JD - ok on first comment. On second, hmm.. Nokia had a lot of bloated staff, and the rapid early firing was the right move. Since then, as Nokia became unprofitable, more recently the cuts have gone too deep, but I was very openly supportive of the early several thousands of staff cuts, painful as they always are. I'd be tempted to say the faster delivery timetibles, are another good change, but they haven't worked. Each of the first 3 Lumias has had unacceptable production problems, these are due to rushed delivery. I can't think of much else. The wheels came off on Feb 11 and since then, Elop has pretty well done the worst management job imaginable - and its not just obsessed Tomi Ahonen who says so, so say for example CNBC who rank Elop now among the worst CEOs worlwide still holding office.

Ken - hilarious. I twittered it already.

anti - yeah, I have a huge ego. But I think I also might already be somebody. How many press articles quote you anti? I stopped counting at 500..

vladkr - haha, no, nobody can replace Eldar but its nice to be considered in that category, even if only momentarily. And thanks for the links. Did you also catch the news the Russian exclusive Nokia reseller is in final talks to abandon Nokia and become exclusive Samsung dealership. OUCH !!

Keep comments coming, I'll return with more replies soon

Tomi Ahonen :-)

Peter

It’s simply baffling how you choose not to accept what has been told to you repeatedly: It is not about you actually misquoting Elop. It is about you using his few statements about the matter misleadingly as an admitted proof for everything you have said previously about Skype-Nokia-operator relationships.


Let’s make it very simple:


THIS STATEMENT:

“…if operator doesn’t want Skype installed on a Windows Phone from Nokia or any other company, then the operator can make that decision.” –Stephen Elop


DOES NOT SAY THAT:


“He(Elop) furthermore admits, the Skype issue has resulted in some carriers actually refusing to carry Lumia."

“…problem so severe the CEO admits it is damaging Nokia smartphone sales.”

“Now Nokia CEO admits they are losing carriers and all operators hate Microsoft because of Skype. “

“Elop has admitted operators hate Skype and hate Nokia Lumia because of the Microsoft Skype connection.”


There. Four counts of using the quote for false assumptions right there. Four counts of pure bullshit. He does not say a word about how Skype is actually affecting the sales or willingness to carry Lumia handsets, he does not say anything about how operators see and deal with Nokia because of the Microsoft-Skype acquisition, and he certainly does not admit any of your conclusions about those. Any details about the topics you discuss are simply not there at all.


Elop’s words can be said to admit only three things: The operators do not like Skype (not really big news there), operators have the right to make a decision not to have Skype installed on WP devices they offer, and that they are negotiating with the operators about alternative business-models regarding VOIP services. See how I’ve used a lot of the word ‘admit’ in this text? That is the key here and also your problem. You could’ve said for example that:


“From Elop’s words it could be interpreted that operators hate also Nokia Lumia because of the Microsoft Skype connection.”


That would’ve been completely ok, as you are entitled to your opinion and viewpoint. But when you just choose to say whatever you wish and twist words while doing it, it becomes a problem. As you have a lot of influence in this area and whatever you say usually goes far in the Internet, it’s even more irresponsible to report your viewpoints like this.


You should finally see that this “attack” you speak of is simply Nokia people finally getting fed about you reporting your ill-conceived conclusions as absolute truth, and informing you about it. That’s something that does not deserve any form of apology.

vladkr

@Tomi: Yes, I saw that Nokia official reseller in Russia will become Samsung ones (first speculations were about multi-brand stores).

There is also another news from WP Komsomol "Windows Phone is outselling iOS in Russia":
http://wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-devices-outselling-iphones-in-russia/

In fact, "Russia" is MTS (biggest communication company in Russia), and iPhones are 3x more expensive than Lumia 710 and 1.6x more expensive than Lumia 800.

More information about MTS sales in Q1 2012 that may interest you:
http://www.mtsgsm.com/blog/file.axd?file=2012%2F4%2FRetail+Report+Q1+2012.pdf

P.S.
MTS is number one in Russia with 102.7M subscribers
Beeline is number two in Russia with 199M subscribers
Megafon is number three in Russia with 62.8M subscribers
(* Source = wikipedia and providers websites, so don't complain to me about figures)

Luca

Ciao Tomi,
I agree with what Peter said, of course you are entitled to have your own opinions (which I personally agree with, by the way) but you are presenting them as facts too much.
Time will probably prove you right but since then you are just another Cassandra… Now that you stated your point you only need to wait near the river and wait for your enemy corpse. Or you may be accused of having shot him, instead of being recognized as the one who first spot the shooter.
So, even if I think Nokia PR people were very wrong engaging a courtyard fight about what has been said and what has not, I don’t think that deserve a formal apology.
By the way, this be the chance to congratulate with you for your nice blog, I find it very interesting, full of deep analysis and useful. The same goes for most of the discussions I read here.
Ciao
Luca
p.s. I was in Oulu in 1998 and had a chance of visiting a Nokia plant, I remember I felt very pride of my 5110 in my pocket… I would love to feel that pride again.

Kaien

I think one word describes your post: Overreaction

Certainly you are right if, Elop made such a statement, which I recall he did. However, considering what Nokia is today, I think that asking for apology is too much considering how much you bashed Nokia leadership (with a righteous reason, may I add!).
Besides according to generally accepted principle of free speech everyone is entitled to their opinion, even if that opinion does not coincide with yours. Theoretically fact is fact, but practically people tend to bend facts to suit their needs, be these facts political, commercial etc., and even you are not free from that habit.


Kirill Zelenski

hi Tomi.
Great! they just made additional ad for you.

DeVard, Savander and Pope will never apologise, be sure. ) they fully support Elop and vice versa. I could say more, while Savander is old Nokia guy and only reason he is not resigned yet he dont care at all, DeVard is bringed to Nokia by Elop, she is doing nothing and Pope seems the same.

and yes, dont worry, you will never become like murtazin. he is stupid, ussing only rumors, your blog to write "own" - you are smart and use your knowledge. :)

Alin

Hi Tomi, many of your readers are with you, like me!

To Peter, those are Tomi's conclusions, not Elops' quotes, anyone can have opinions, like it or not! Nokia should do better to not even let place for such opinions, but since Elop is in charge, only suspicious actions had been taken, and blogs and social sites are for that reason, to exprime opinions!!! Tomi is indeed a NAME in this industry and would not take a risk with his writtings.

PeterElgin

@tomi,

Someone used my long term name Peter that might confuse you in your blog.

I am a nokia investor who has advocated the firing, suing and arresting of Steven Elop and Olilla Jorma since 2/11/2011.

Now I'll changed my blog name to PeterElgin to clarify confusion.

Tomi, you has been correct about skype.
No need to debate further with Elop hired trolls.

We are true nokia shareholders, not like those Wall Street Short sellers who hold 15% shares in total while sold short 30% in another hand of nokia shares.

These trolls are hired by Elop who himself is hired by these Wall Street Short sellers like Goldman Sucks.

Elop is dispatched into nokia to dismantle nokia from inside via the hand of Olilla Jorman, the crony agent of Wall Street Bankers.

That's why he dumped promising propducts like N8/N9/N950 and previous management team who had the right strategy.

Keep your good analysis and ignore trolls who are hired by Elop to distract your insights and precious work which will be used in the suit against Steven Elop in US Court.


Regards,
PeterElgin


vladkr

@Kirill :
Most Murtazin's information that was considered as rumours appeared to be true.

He was the first to announce MS-Nokia partnership before it became official, like Tomi he made precise forecasts of Nokia's situation, he announced a high-end phone using Symbian well before 808 was shown (though he was wrong about its design) when everybody thought it would be 100% WP, and so on.

Off course he made mistakes, but most of time, he was right.

You can have a closer look to the website his involved in (Mobile Review), and you'll see he's much more serious than you think.

cycnus

@Peter

Tomi didn't do wrong.
It just like when Elop were judged,
and when the lawyer (nokia shareholder) were questioning Elop.
Elop lie, but the jury (tomi) can see right thru him.

What make me curious,
why you were keep hitting tomi and saying tomi wrong.
Why don't you see that there were a bigger problem here,
that Elop lie, and this could ruin nokia
If you were here for nokia, you should be worry more about elop lying that tomi exposed it.

BTW,
when reading tomi post,
and I read comment like baron01-baron95, I mean you (peter), tomifan, and other conversation.nokia.com alias in here.
I know Tomi were successful in showing the public what went wrong with nokia.

Kirill Zelenski

hi vladkr.

Nokia MS cooperation was very clear for everybody inside Nokia (at least Nokia House in Espoo) and even outside, months before he "disclosed" it.

I know his mobilereview. :)) I was working at Nokia in HQ and know how when and what murtazin was publishing about Nokia. i had a possibility to compare with facts, in both english and russian. Tomi is predicting future, murtazin is not. he only can predict something by disclosing internal NDA info, if he have (now mostly not, because everyone know him already) which is illegal. if not, he is even not able to analyse current open things - he haveno clue how to read financial reports etc.. his russian language is even worse than english...
I stopped to read it totally and can only recommend do the same.

I have lot to say about this person, but just dont want to spend my time for it. it is laughingstock of telecom.
))))))))))))

Peter

@cycnus

If we go with your courtroom analogy, then Tomi acts as a prosecutor that puts words in the mouth of the defendant (Elop). He simply can't make assumptions based on those and claim that they are therefore true. I criticize Tomi because I feel the way he acts is just plain wrong. I also hate the current situation the Nokia is in, I'm a proud owner of N9 and I hate the fact they discarded it -such a waste of potential- but it still does not approve what Tomi is doing.

I'm sorry but I've no idea what do you mean with your conversation.nokia.com sentence.

My apologies also to Peter Elgin, sorry for stealing your sexy name.

Tomifan

@Peter (non-Elgin one)
TOTALLY agree. I already commented those same things to Tomi's blog which was response to the Nokia's "here's the full Elop saying w/video" response.
He asked me to continue discussion here and I said I'd be happy to.

@Fan(atic)
Totally agree - Tomi managed to make more text from previously mentioned few-sentence response. ;-)

@Tomi
I don't want to repost. If someone is interested in hearing Peter's (non-Elgin) response put with other words, they can go and read my comment in your two-bloggings-ago comment section.
Still, Pope has all reason to be mad. You definitely did not attribute a single _word_ to be said by Elop that he didn't say. checked. Proven. Fact.
But you intentionally picked only parts of a sentence and claimed those to be answers to a larger context. That's not valid and if Pope had done same to your blog, you would be even more furious than you are at the moment.

Tomifan

@Tomi
Was left out from my previous comment (just a bit above):
I DO AGREE WITH YOU on the fact that Pope or Nokia has NO RIGHT WHATSOEVER to start some kind of crusade over Twitter because they feel you acted wrong. They should have just jumped into here and comment with justifications and proof. That's what we civilized beings do.
And they are just making this worse tweet by tweet - not smart.
Anyway, waiting for your comments, shall they be to my comment or to others.

@cycnus
Nice that you share Tomi's view on this comment section having paid Nokia muppets posting against him.
I went through that topic briefly in that 10-page long comment thread of Original Shareholder Meeting Post. Only thing that has changed since is that I have been added to list of potential candidates (by you). I guess I have to ask Nokia to start sending me paychecks now. After all I have probably been worst Tomi-fan ever. haha
Since Tomi gave me quite long response back in the previous comment chain and kept it in really civilized level, I'm not going to give any weight on that comment from now on. But thanks for attention, lovely to see I'm being noticed. ;-)

vladkr

@Kirill:
As you don't want to waste your time in making comments about E.Murtazin or reading his articles, here's a quick sum-up:

On Feb 13, 2011: He wrote that Nokia would be destroyed within two years, and that Samsung would take the lead.

May 3rd, 2011: WP7 is a fail, so WP8 will

June 28th, 2011: Plans of TeliaSonera to charge extras for mobile internet use... okay Skype wasn't clearly mentioned

and so on...

These predictions appeared to be right, and it can be easily double-checked.

He made some mistakes also, such as underestimating problems between Skype and operators (may 17th 2011), though the issue was already mentioned.

His overall record is not that bad; his Russian... well, I won't judge as Russian is not my main language.


However, I can understand you; Nokia is not the first company where executives lie to their workers.

I used to work for French defence companies and not only once directors, VPs or CEO denied sayings published in the press, that appeared to be true afterwards.

Believe it or not, but press was better informed than average workers, and that happens in many companies. Strangely, workers have usually more reproaches against the press than to their bosses.

Tomifan

@Piot
You're the first one to give counter-statements about what has been going on in Twitter. Please tell us more. It would be superb to hear "outsider" view of the thing.
(Don't have Twitter account and couldn't figure out how to successfully follow that mess of a postings)

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    Tomi Ahonen is a bestselling author whose twelve books on mobile have already been referenced in over 100 books by his peers. Rated the most influential expert in mobile by Forbes in December 2011, Tomi speaks regularly at conferences doing about 20 public speakerships annually. With over 250 public speaking engagements, Tomi been seen by a cumulative audience of over 100,000 people on all six inhabited continents. The former Nokia executive has run a consulting practise on digital convergence, interactive media, engagement marketing, high tech and next generation mobile. Tomi is currently based out of Hong Kong but supports Fortune 500 sized companies across the globe. His reference client list includes Axiata, Bank of America, BBC, BNP Paribas, China Mobile, Emap, Ericsson, Google, Hewlett-Packard, HSBC, IBM, Intel, LG, MTS, Nokia, NTT DoCoMo, Ogilvy, Orange, RIM, Sanomamedia, Telenor, TeliaSonera, Three, Tigo, Vodafone, etc. To see his full bio and his books, visit www.tomiahonen.com Tomi Ahonen lectures at Oxford University's short courses on next generation mobile and digital convergence. Follow him on Twitter as @tomiahonen. Tomi also has a Facebook and Linked In page under his own name. He is available for consulting, speaking engagements and as expert witness, please write to tomi (at) tomiahonen (dot) com

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